tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post57121521549587475..comments2024-03-28T05:28:28.567-04:00Comments on Editorial Anonymous: The CSK Is Dead (Long Live the CSK)Editorial Anonymoushttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06294247222893767117noreply@blogger.comBlogger88125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-83981295968756745582021-08-05T02:16:49.654-04:002021-08-05T02:16:49.654-04:00kyrie 6
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The...Where is the questioning of the newbery award? The Caldecott? I mean the pigeon can drive the bus but Ashley Bryan still has to sit in the back? <br />There has been racism (if not overt than screamingly tacit) in the major awards and in the publishing world for years. That is in part the reason for the creation of the CSK award, to finally attempt to bring some equality into publishing and to celebrate diversity in literature.<br />How many African Americans have won the newbery? The Caldecott? It was a sad day indeed for the horn book when they referenced your blog in a recent issue, making it seem that you were actually presenting an intellectual argument. <br />In that same issue there was a wonderful piece written by Nikki Grimes, I would point you in that direction for a well needed history lesson.<br />It is shocking to see that you have such a terrible grasp on what the CSK award means. Your misguided attempts to explain what the CSK is "saying" is true ignorance in action.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-54018737879354953232009-05-27T05:07:58.742-04:002009-05-27T05:07:58.742-04:00It is clear through this passionate discussion tha...It is clear through this passionate discussion that there needs to be more opportunities for dialog related to culture, ethnicity, class, etc. as they are presented within the diverse field of children's literature. Awards such as the Coretta Scott King and Pura Belpré were created because of the stereotypes and cultural inaccuracies perpetuated in children's books and the overall dearth in authentic children's literature representing black and Latino cultural experiences. Authors and illustrators that were black or Latino were not always given the opportunity to create quality books about their culture. Instead, it was Anglo authors/illustrators that created books about the "other."<br />While we could forever debate who has the "right to write," our ultimate goal should be to make high quality, authentic, and accurate literature about all cultures available to children. All children deserve to see themselves positively represented within the literature that they encounter. Awards such as the Belpre and CSK allow voices previously silenced to create books that represent their experiences within America.<br />Someone who is Latino or African American is not limited to writing only about their culture and there are those authors/illustrators that prefer not to create books about their cultural group. However, there are those within a particular culture that do see it as their right (or obligation) to create literature about their experiences.<br />Ultimately, it is possible for someone from outside a culture to write about a culture that isn't their own and do a good job. If that person isn't eligible for an award such as the Belpré, then they still have an opportunity to win other awards such as the Americas. Most authors/illustrators do not create a work with the intent that they might win an award for their effort. The award is an added bonus - icing on the cake.<br />Cultural specific awards are needed to raise an awareness of the types of books being published about various groups of people. Someone posted that there should be awards for everything and every cultural group. It is important to look at the body of literature available about various cultural groups. If the majority of books available about a culture perpetuate stereotypes or are relatively few in number, then perhaps we should consider finding ways to increase books about that culture through something such as a literary award. There are numerous books available that represent many different aspects of the Anglo experience; an award specific to Anglos is not needed as the majority of books that represent the culture do not perpetuate stereotypes.<br />If I as a white male were to illustrate a book about young Latinas, then no my work would not be considered for the Belpré because I was not Latino. However, I could be considered for the Caldecott, Jane Addams, Americas, or any number of other awards. So, I'm not eligible for the Belpré Award - is it the end of the world? Am I any more dissatisfied with my work because I have created a book that is not eligible for a particular award? I think not. This same book is not eligible for the Newbery and if it does not contain lesbian, gay, bisexual, or transgender characters, then the book would never make ALA's Rainbow List. When I want to create a piece of work, I do it to honor and respect a particular culture not because I think I can win an award. Yes, awards can help boost the sales of a book but they are not the end-all important goal for creating a piece of literature representing a particular culture. The ultimate goal is to create culturally authentic and accurate literature that reflects the lives of children.jamie naidoonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-88674674729334598742009-05-24T19:05:32.503-04:002009-05-24T19:05:32.503-04:00It has been a long day and I am bushwacked..... bu...It has been a long day and I am bushwacked..... but just to say, EA you are wonderful and I am so glad you brought up this topic and your thoughts....you rock...aenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-9973782509742523672009-05-24T18:14:30.255-04:002009-05-24T18:14:30.255-04:00Social-- Sorry to upset you--I think you missed th...Social-- Sorry to upset you--I think you missed the point of my Condi Rice allusion.<br /><br />(Note--I don't agree with all her policies and politics, but I DO think she is brilliant and hard-working and deserved her position. I also think that she has a right to espouse whatever politics and policies she judges best...)<br /><br />My point is, that, in the end, I think racism is a problem of treating people as undifferentiated groups rather than as individuals.<br /><br />So anyone who says "Blacks should believe X, and any black who doesn't believe x is (insert racist insult here)" is a racist, regardless of their skin color. Because color of skin does not dictate a person's beliefs.<br /><br />Likewise (bringing this back to books!) if someone tells a black author her writing is insufficiently 'black', or that her topics and plots and characters aren't 'serious' enough or aren't conveying the right message for a black author, he is a racist, no matter what his color.<br /><br />And this seems to be the current problem with the CSK, based on the conversation. It's deeming some topics (African-American history and family life) appropriate 'black' subject matter, and others (fantasy, scifi, light humor) seem to be discouraged. <br /><br />Maybe the answer is more awards, with a broader range. Maybe the answer is to try to get publishers to branch out a little more, or to encourage black authors to branch out (more scifi and fantasy, please! Yey Virginia Hamilton!)<br /><br />But, in the end, to conquer racism, we need to stop seeing black children's authors as primarily 'black', and start seeing them as primarily 'authors.'Deirdre Mundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14357363160387734552noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-22064036766916754482009-05-24T13:05:18.979-04:002009-05-24T13:05:18.979-04:00This has been an interesting discussion. What I'v...This has been an interesting discussion. What I've gleaned from this is that there is racism in publishing. That part of the problem with Writers of color getting their work printed is that there are not that many people of color making these decisions. So there is a systemic problem of racism that is active. But it seems to me that you, EA, should not be blaming CSK award for this problem. This award was developed at a time when the playing field was not balanced and it's still not. And instead of pointing to Coretta Scott Kings legacy and saying something is wrong with that why don't you as a white person take it upon yourself to fix the systemic problems that keep excluding authors of color. You should look to your own community and fix what's there before you start throwing stones at the Black community. Why is it up to us to fix a problem that your community has created over the past three hundred some odd years. That smacks of a bit too much privilege.michaelTO61noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-2843850020267117362009-05-24T12:55:48.198-04:002009-05-24T12:55:48.198-04:00this "Deirdre Mundy" person is spouting typical gr...this "Deirdre Mundy" person is spouting typical grade school level logic that american conservatives love to repeat these days. 90% of it is worthless as a basis for useful discussion, and i dont look to follow my previous comments with much further discussion because, frankly i dont have to the time nor the inclination to say much else on this blog. nevertheless, i do want to say that 1. i dont fall for the "it's class not race" con. 2. the ramblings about individual successful blacks and the last jibe about protest careers were laughably so laughably off the mark its apparently she doesnt even understand my point. good thing is, however, whether she understands it or not is completely irrelevant.socialtalkerhttp://nntr.usnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-44352362975747788452009-05-23T11:29:50.784-04:002009-05-23T11:29:50.784-04:00"Without anger, there would be no social change." ..."Without anger, there would be no social change." The Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous<br /><br />socialtalker - I do hope you channel that anger into building those publishing companies.Sarah Laurensonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09252565450452195395noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-89673310964576891992009-05-23T11:23:09.305-04:002009-05-23T11:23:09.305-04:00Social Talker, you said:
"Racism" ends when the l...Social Talker, you said:<br /><br />"Racism" ends when the lives and economic, social, cultural and pychological well being of black folks around the world are independent of the control and domination of whites and anyone else. <br /><br /><br />---<br /><br />I'm not sure that anyone living in a society can have a life truly independant of control and domination. There will always be rules, they will always be applied unfairly (Look at all the great communist nations, who had/have an upper class of the politically connected and an underclass of the politically oppressed), and there will always be some people who feel that the current level of oppression and domination is unacceptable. <br /><br />That said, I would understand your point if you meant that you didn't want blacks oppressed BECAUSE THEY WERE BLACK. <br /><br />I also think that, in some ways, the modern US has made great strides. We've basically replaced the ETHNIC overclass with an EDUCATIONAL overclass. If you're black and go to Harvard, you can be in the overclass. If you're 100% WASP and you don't go to college at all, have fun working at Target, sir, cause that's where you're stuck. <br /><br />I used to think this was a fine state of things (yey meritocracy!, but after moving to an area where most people DON'T have degrees from any college, much less an elite one, I'm not really any fonder of this new form of sorting, as opposed to the old one.<br /><br />But I also think that racism is kept alive by the very people who argue it must be conquered.<br /><br />I mean, seriously, a class black woman, through education and hard work, exceled in school, rose to become provost of Stanford and Secretary of State. But because she was the wrong party, civil rights activists called her 'uncle Tom' and a 'house slave.'<br /><br />But if she'd served the previous president, she'd be a hero in the fight against racism.<br /><br />Racism doesn't end until minorities aren't considered 'race-traitors' for joining the wrong political party. Racism doesn't end until, when an athlete wins the masters, he's not asked what his victory means to black Americans. Racism doesn't end until race doesn't MATTER any more than 'My grandma came from Italy and so I make her cookie recipe' matters. (And it used to matter, about 2 generations ago...so things can change....)<br /><br />But I think a lot of the people who claim to be militantly fighting AGAINST racism are actually perpetuating it-- which (Warning-extreme cynicism approaching--) makes sense, because if racism actually STOPPED being an issue, a lot of people who spend so much time talking/protesting/getting elected would be out of a job........Deirdre Mundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14357363160387734552noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-9180227120930218702009-05-23T06:09:59.282-04:002009-05-23T06:09:59.282-04:00Thank you for your superb example of how racism wo...Thank you for your superb example of how racism works today. i will use it in my own teachings. <br />your rant starts off quite condescending and goes downhill from there. <br />Editorial Anonymous supposedly decries racism while at the same time showing typical race baiting behavior of singling out a black example AND declaring her connotation as the definitive definition of when racism is over. <br /><br />"Racism" ends when the lives and economic, social, cultural and pychological well being of black folks around the world are independent of the control and domination of whites and anyone else. <br />your intolerance of our independence is what will continue the divisiveness, not some goofy, braindead definition of identity being a colorless "human".<br /><br /><br />This article shows no reason for singling out the CSK award from the thousands of awards given with all kinds of particular qualifers ie a certain country, region, lauguage sex, etc. this is class race baiting.<br /><br />there is NOTHING that has EVER stopped whites from feeling the complete freedom to exploit black culture/life in any way they like and feel they have the perfect right to do so however vulgar and twisted the interpetation. this entire argument is completely disengenious as to be downright insulting. <br /><br />whats ironic is that whites control the vast majority of black culture in many industries, books, music, shows etc. and most of what is created is garbage. but thats not thats the main racist issue for aronson, this nameless writ or other white elites, there can be no peace in the land unless they have full control of even the measures of what and how black folks see as their best.<br /><br />I cant stomach the thought of someone like this EA character editing black children's books. I feel a renewed commitment to save and build black publishing companies. this is war, for real.socialtalker@yahoo.comhttp://nntr.usnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-21768212801099748772009-05-22T18:04:14.876-04:002009-05-22T18:04:14.876-04:00Toddlers identify with books about sounds and repe...Toddlers identify with books about sounds and repetition. You could be a purple cricket and chirp purple. Purple chirp purple chirp.<br /><br />They love the classic nursery rhymes (my kids and I did and still do) but I think nowadays like everything... there has to be that additional sales hook (more reasons to buy a book than one thing of appeal). The competition for everything has increased trifold. The more hooks the better.<br /><br /><br />And EVERYONE wants to write a picture book. I swear EVERYONE. :)aenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-24506191757712471822009-05-22T16:47:02.167-04:002009-05-22T16:47:02.167-04:00LV- As far as I can tell from my experience (toddl...LV- As far as I can tell from my experience (toddler son), Boys don't want picture books about boys OR girls.<br /><br />They want books about dogs, trucks, and dinosaurs. Or maybe that's just my crazy sun (20 months old and has memorized 'Go dog go' and 'Dinosaur roar!')Deirdre Mundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14357363160387734552noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-52268002880963296122009-05-22T13:24:58.013-04:002009-05-22T13:24:58.013-04:00Anonymous May 18, 2009 1:07 PM,
I don't know abou...Anonymous May 18, 2009 1:07 PM,<br /><br />I don't know about YA agents and publishers. I have read agents' public statements that they want "boy-friendly" picture books. <br /><br />Not only is the world already boy-friendly, it's well known that girls will read about boys but boys will not read about girls. That's the fault of society, not of publishing, but publishing workers ought not to encourage it--just as they should not encourage racist reading habits.pulphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09338209570035044103noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-54317574482047877032009-05-21T08:14:07.292-04:002009-05-21T08:14:07.292-04:00Well said, Mitali! Well said,
When you're facing...Well said, Mitali! Well said,<br /><br />When you're facing a profit and loss calculation/discussion in which Sales and Marketing are heavily involved the numbers for any author are daunting - regardless of color. But more so for authors of different ethnicities.<br /><br />Maybe publishing should break out of it's own narrow box. If that happened -- if publishers started looking more closely at the target audience (the child/youth/teen) they'd get a few surprises and this discussion would be moot.Christinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15343502038138971001noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-43453972934571928092009-05-21T06:24:15.272-04:002009-05-21T06:24:15.272-04:00Go Dierdre!Go Dierdre!aenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-40675517410884615522009-05-20T22:54:21.092-04:002009-05-20T22:54:21.092-04:00Buffy, you nearly made me spit all over my monitor...Buffy, you nearly made me spit all over my monitor with that comment. =) Good one!<br /><br />But I hadn't realized Nadine Gordimer was a man. =) And J.M. Coetzee isn't anglo-saxon.<br /><br />Actually, reading down the list of winners on the Wikipedia entry, the Booker has gone to a really diverse group--Africans, Asians, South Asians, Irish, Brits.... It may be more diverse than the Newberry for the same span of years!<br /><br />But I'm too tired to do a comparison, so I'll leave that up to someone else. =)Deirdre Mundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14357363160387734552noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-22223949278320841202009-05-20T21:26:14.166-04:002009-05-20T21:26:14.166-04:00Would it be ok to have an award that celebrated "W...<I>Would it be ok to have an award that celebrated "WASP Males writing about WASP Males?"</I>I think it's called the Booker.nonehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00415222406280230021noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-84121727872645617202009-05-20T17:53:58.503-04:002009-05-20T17:53:58.503-04:00One other thing I've been thinking about...
Would...One other thing I've been thinking about...<br /><br />Would it be ok to have an award that celebrated "WASP Males writing about WASP Males?"<br /><br />Why or why not?<br /><br />What about "A resident of Milwaukee writing about residents of Milwaukee?"<br /><br />How about "A Catholic writing about Catholics?"<br /><br />"A Buddhist writing about Buddhists?"<br /><br />When is it acceptable for an award to be exclusive and when is it not?<br /><br />Why is it considered to have an all-female sorority, but not an all-male country club?<br /><br />To me, the CSK is sort of borderline in this sense--on the one hand, they want to honor members of a certain group, and they're free to do so....<br /><br />BUT if someone was giving out WASP awards, would there be an outcry? <br /><br />Also, how do these awards targeted for an ethnic group decide what constitutes an "African-American" or a "Hispanic?"<br /><br />Would a recent immigrant from Etheopia be eligible for CSK? What about Egypt? What about Libya?<br /><br />Are you Hispanic if your Italian grandparents moved to Argentina, and then your parents moved to the US?<br /><br />What if you're multi-racial? Who is 'Black' enough to recieve CSK?<br /><br />Or what if you were adopted? And you're not really sure of your race, you're just guessing based on physical charactaristics?<br /><br />I guess one problem I have with race-based awards, scholarships, etc is that race ISN'T really clear cut. So how do you decide who's in and who's out?Deirdre Mundyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14357363160387734552noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-33822480530665739792009-05-20T16:19:12.974-04:002009-05-20T16:19:12.974-04:00I love what a thoughtful discussion this is.
Than...I love what a thoughtful discussion this is.<br /><br />Thanks to everyone for sharing your points of view!Editorial Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06294247222893767117noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-86252663585070774952009-05-20T15:40:29.091-04:002009-05-20T15:40:29.091-04:00Delux, I could not agree more. No one award can be...Delux, I could not agree more. No one award can be all things to all people. Each one has its own particular focus. <br /><br />There already are awards for people of any ethnicity. It's true that historically they have been won most often by whites, but that has begun to change, probably for a number of reasons. How, though, does that take away from the CSK's validity?Diane Footehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18189783382263958883noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-6669935324940347792009-05-20T12:47:29.906-04:002009-05-20T12:47:29.906-04:00Right on, Mitali.
There is a black box that limit...Right on, Mitali. <br />There is a black box that limits the subject matter black authors can get published, but it's not the fault of the CSK awards. It's the publishing industry's. Editors pitch black projects to black authors. And during Black History Month, publishing houses justify why white authors can write about black themes. White authors have the latitude to cross over. Their black counterparts often do not (superstars/illustrators excepted).<br />Regardless of the field of endeavor, the playing field is not level. Black folks are not allowed as much cross-cultural creative range or as many missteps. The gap and the divide persist. Many white folks don't (and never will) get it, because they don't have to in the skin they're in.<br />The CSK awards are needed to shine the light on excellent black books and on those books' creators. Children of color need to know that they can become authors and illustrators, too.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-7851870351851736882009-05-20T08:29:41.999-04:002009-05-20T08:29:41.999-04:00My advice is to leave the CSK alone and check for ...My advice is to leave the CSK alone and check for the proverbial logs in our own eyes. <br /><br />We're a community of adults with the same goal -- getting great stories into the hearts and minds of young people.<br /><br />What if we each make a change that's relatively risky?<br /><br />Writers, let's improve our craft until we're creating such great stories nobody has an excuse not to buy them. Let's ask ourselves <A HREF="http://www.mitaliblog.com/2009/04/writing-race-checklist-for-writers.html" REL="nofollow">questions</A> about how and why we're representing race in our writing.<br /><br />Editors, acquire another book or two that makes you squirm a bit with a sense of your own cultural illiteracy and/or privilege.<br /><br />Publicity people, champion another title that grownups might not think will sell because you GET that this is <A HREF="http://www.mitaliblog.com/2009/04/not-your-mothers-market.html" REL="nofollow">not your mother's market.</A>Librarians and teachers, book talk or assign a new title featuring a protagonist from a completely different class or ethnic group than your audience.<br /><br />Booksellers, handsell another title or two that at first glance might not be picked up by the demographic coming into your store.<br /><br />Readers and bloggers, <A HREF="http://www.mitaliblog.com/2009/05/crossed-border-lately.html" REL="nofollow">cross an extra border this summer</A>. Parents, bring your kids with you.<br /><br />I know so many of you taking these kinds of risks, and we celebrate them. Let's push each other to more.<br /><br />The reason this conversation matters so much is because we know that stories can change the world. Didactism aside, they can heal, restore, reconcile, convict, and inspire. The exciting thing is that we're in charge of the most powerful stories of all -- the ones that serve the next generation.<br /><br />Sorry for the sermon. I'm off to try and write a better book.mbpbookshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16081024119047826077noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-1507768815332427282009-05-20T07:17:47.089-04:002009-05-20T07:17:47.089-04:00I support your premise that the playing field need...I support your premise that the playing field needs to be evened. But this award has a historical context that should not be dismissed or redefined so easily. To attempt to do so is to diminish the men and women who brought about the change in the first place. This award can be open to one segment of our race out of respect for those histories while be enjoyed and celebrated by everyone.jdsanchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04658357606303732115noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7986595816238301046.post-35005287611043362002009-05-20T04:03:31.401-04:002009-05-20T04:03:31.401-04:00I am utterly astonished at the assumptions inheren...I am utterly astonished at the assumptions inherent in so many of these comments. <br /><br />Particularly that the CSK awards have so much influence in Black creative communities that they actually exert some sort of control what Black authors actually choose to write about. <br /> <br />Do the people saying these things actually engage with members of Black arts communities?<br /><br /><I>that says, if you're NOT black, there's no point writing/illustrating a book about black people, because you and the book will be marginalized. </I>No it doesnt. It says 'here's an award for Black people writing about Black people.' <br /><br />If it's that important, well, anyone who wants to can make an award for "people of any race who further the understanding of what it means to be black."Deluxnoreply@blogger.com